Offline IMLast updated Tue Aug 21, 2007 Member since September 2005
A Golem's Blog Full Post View | List View
My life, Radical jewish spirituality, gay politics/sex, any stray ideas/hot guys that pass my consciousness, books, gym
- Entry for February 13, 2009
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Haven't posted anything for a while, but I'm soproud of my husband that I want to get this down.
Last night was pretty special, and I'm still coming down from it. Two and a half years before Stonewall there was a demonstration for gay rights in Los Angeles. On New Years eve 1966-67, at midnight, men in a gay bar, The Black Cat kissed to celebrate the New Year.
12 people were arrested for lewd conduct and that generated a demonstration, exactly 42 years ago yesterday (Monday.) My husband decided to do something to commemorate that event, and he has been working all year to ge the bar, still standing, now called Le Barcito, declared a city historic and cultural landmark.
He shepherded the whole process, from the historians and architectual experts through the City Commission and finally by unanimous vote of the LA City Council, it happened.
Last night we had a big party at the bar. Our City Councilman was there and gave him a plaque. There were leather men and drag queens, gays, dykes and straights. Rev. Troy Perry, founder of MCC gave a speech. The LA Times was there. Also about 200 people. Christopher Street West, which puts on Gay Pride in LA arranged to have a buffet supper.
I had also spoken on its behalf at the Commission and the City Council. I was just incredibly proud of him, and proud to be his husband. The gay community has taken so much bad news recently, it was nice to have something to celebrate. The LAPD, which had arrested those guys originally, even sent a delegation.
It was just a wonderful high for both of us. It's 4:00 in the afternoon, and the poor boy is sleeping, but he certainly deserves a nap. We have even received inquiries from national gay organizations about having a declaration from Congress!Friday February 13, 2009 - 12:23am (PST) Permanent Link | 1 Comment - Entry for September 26, 2008
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Whoa!! You have waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy over intellectualized this. What you are forgetting about is the emotional component. I was 16 once and questioning my sexuality, hoping to God I was at least bisexual, I got a girlfriend, we did it several times, full on, the str8 version of the rather graphic description I made earlier. It just did not do it for me. The emotional component flat lined. I was 16, so if you just breathed on me, I got hard, that wasn't the issue, the issue was not feeling it emotionally. When I had my first guy, wooooohooooo! there it was, everything I had hoped for and more. So, I have to disagree, it was not a learned behavior. Believe me, I tried, I really didn't want to be exclusively gay, and get a life of BS from the heterofacist.TxTraveler wrote:Hi Dys. I'm going to assume this was addressed to my post. If it wasn't, please ignore this reply.
<quoted text>
If you don't already know this, I cannot help you without getting bogged down in a semantics debate I don't have time for. Try a google search.
<quoted text>
The exact same way one learns to enjoy smoking or drinking beer. Specifically:
Step 1 - See it, hear about it, consider it, dream it up, be curious about it, not necessarily all of these or in any particular order.
Step 2 - Learn something about it, try it, deal with any difficulties encountered (coughing, gagging, nausea, etc) and try it again.
Step 3 - Decide that the pros outweigh the cons and continue the behavior, in this case, smoking.
Help any?
“We are made Holy to each other”
Joined: May 7, 2007Comments: 8422Los AngelesISP Location: Los Angeles, CA
Again, you assume without proof. Growing up in the Midwest in the 50's and 60's I had no idea of the possibility of sex with another man. As I began to understand more, given my new knowledge that not only could I have sex with another male, but that I could love one with a fierce love that I had never experienced with a woman.TxTraveler wrote:<quoted text>
The simple truth is that at some point in your past you learned to enjoy gay sex. I never took that class, and that's the difference between us.
Much of my feelings, actions and fantasies going back as far as I could remember made sense, finally. I understood why I had wanted to matter to certain boys as the most important person in their lives, and them in mine, since at least age 8, and had never had similar feelings for girls.
I understood how another boy's smile could make my whole day, where if a girl friend was angry with me, it just didn't upset me or turn my world upside down in the same way.
It wasn't until I was 21, almost 22, that I began meeting gay men who were my peers. By this point I had already had sex with girls in high school. It was sort of basically OK, but emotionally not much different from masturbating with a friend. I thought of these girls as "girlfriends," and really thought that I would marry one of them one day, not knowing any better. Some of them remain friends to this day.
But the first time I had sex with another man, it was a completely different experience, that I could feel in the depths of my body and that shook my soul.
Your idea that I learned to be gay from gay experience is just so much smoke, trying to patch up your understanding of the way the world works by striving after wind.
I am not very interested in the percent that various factors played to my sexual orientation. Combination of genetics, interuterine hormones, very early experiences. I know that certainly by kindergarden my orientation was already determined.
I have been blessed to have met my husband, my Intended One and to have married him, living together for 26 years and now married according to the law of the State of California and the Law of Moses and of Israel since June 20th.
I have sworn a vow to him and before G-d to defend that marriage and to be with him in joy and sorrow, health and sickness, and whatever else life and the good Lord may bring our way, and I don't intend to stand idly by while bigots like you seek to destroy my marriage and to void our vows to each other. “We are made Holy to each other”
Joined: May 7, 2007Comments: 8422Los AngelesISP Location: Los Angeles, CA
You would seem to have the bizarre definition of "natural." A thing is said to be natural if it is found in nature, rather than human made. A thing can be natural whether or not it is moral and whether or not it is healthy.TxTraveler wrote:<quoted text>
You have a very bizarre definition of "natural". That people will continue to perform actions they find pleasurable is obvious. Some people find S&M or B&D pleasurable, and to them it is merely something they do with their chosen partner. It's hardly "natural" though. Eating doughnuts is pleasurable too, but it can hardly be called natural since it will result in obesity and possibly diabetes if overdone. Choosing to do something does not make it "natural".
Leaving aside the question of whether donuts can be considered natural, it is certainly for a dog to eat all the food that it finds, either within a human home or within the wild. The dog may eat too much and become obese, it may eat something that is toxic or eat may eat its own puppies right after giving birth to them. None of these actions are "unnatural."
There are repeated studies posted on this Board showing that homosexual coupling, even long term coupling occurs in many species. Natually. Your claim of it being unnatural becomes an exercise in nonsense.
Further, you cannot then turn arund and claim that homosexuality is immoral because it is unnatural, when we have just established that it is natural.
What you are arguing is that being actively gay does not meet your personal standards of morality. But no gay person is trying or cares about your standards of morality.
More circular reasoning and begging the question. “A strength that surpasses you.”
Joined: Jun 4, 2007Comments: 144Los AngelesISP Location: Northridge, CA
Your eloquence far exceeds mine, in fact you make me feel like a ruff-neck..lol Your post was/is very moving. I too, felt like you, and was moved to my core and very soul when had my first boyfriend.The Golem wrote:<quoted text>
Again, you assume without proof. Growing up in the Midwest in the 50's and 60's I had no idea of the possibility of sex with another man. As I began to understand more, given my new knowledge that not only could I have sex with another male, but that I could love one with a fierce love that I had never experienced with a woman.
Much of my feelings, actions and fantasies going back as far as I could remember made sense, finally. I understood why I had wanted to matter to certain boys as the most important person in their lives, and them in mine, since at least age 8, and had never had similar feelings for girls.
I understood how another boy's smile could make my whole day, where if a girl friend was angry with me, it just didn't upset me or turn my world upside down in the same way.
It wasn't until I was 21, almost 22, that I began meeting gay men who were my peers. By this point I had already had sex with girls in high school. It was sort of basically OK, but emotionally not much different from masturbating with a friend. I thought of these girls as "girlfriends," and really thought that I would marry one of them one day, not knowing any better. Some of them remain friends to this day.
But the first time I had sex with another man, it was a completely different experience, that I could feel in the depths of my body and that shook my soul.
Your idea that I learned to be gay from gay experience is just so much smoke, trying to patch up your understanding of the way the world works by striving after wind.
I am not very interested in the percent that various factors played to my sexual orientation. Combination of genetics, interuterine hormones, very early experiences. I know that certainly by kindergarden my orientation was already determined.
I have been blessed to have met my husband, my Intended One and to have married him, living together for 26 years and now married according to the law of the State of California and the Law of Moses and of Israel since June 20th.
I have sworn a vow to him and before G-d to defend that marriage and to be with him in joy and sorrow, health and sickness, and whatever else life and the good Lord may bring our way, and I don't intend to stand idly by while bigots like you seek to destroy my marriage and to void our vows to each other. “We are made Holy to each other”
Joined: May 7, 2007Comments: 8422Los AngelesISP Location: Los Angeles, CA
Wow! Thanks. I hope that what I post is mainly for other Queer folk, and secondly to help our friends understand what our love means.Sean D wrote:<quoted text>
Your eloquence far exceeds mine, in fact you make me feel like a ruff-neck..lol Your post was/is very moving. I too, felt like you, and was moved to my core and very soul when had my first boyfriend.
I don't care much what the phobes who have hardened their hearts against us think. They will have to live with their own bile.
I am scarcely the writer that Dylan Thomas was, but I think he expressed my motives in his own great poem:
In My Craft or Sullen Art
In my craft or sullen art
Exercised in the still night
When only the moon rages
And the lovers lie abed
With all their griefs in their arms,
I labour by singing light
Not for ambition or bread
Or the strut and trade of charms
On the ivory stages
But for the common wages
Of their most secret heart.
Not for the proud man apart
From the raging moon I write
On these spindrift pages
Not for the towering dead
With their nightingales and psalms
But for the lovers, their arms
Round the griefs of the ages,
Who pay no praise or wages
Nor heed my craft or art.
-- Dylan ThomasFriday September 26, 2008 - 03:16pm (PDT) Permanent Link | 0 Comments - Entry for September 09, 2008
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Books are good...Palin is bad!
The following is a list of books that Sarah Palin tried to get
banned when she was mayor of Wasilla, Alaska.
This information is taken from the official minutes of the Wasilla Library Board .
When the librarian refused to ban the books, Palin tried to get her fired...
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
A Clock work Orange by Anthony Burgess
A Wrinkle in Time by Madeleine L' Engle
Annie on My Mind by Nancy Garden
As I Lay Dying by William Faulkner
Blubber by Judy Blume
Brave New World by Aldous Huxley
Bridge to Terabithia by Katherine Paterson
Canterbury Tales by Chaucer
Carrie by Stephen King
Catch - 22 by Joseph Heller
Chris tine by Stephen King
Confession s by Jean- Jacques Rousseau
Cujoby Stephen King
Curses, Hexes , and Spell s by Daniel Cohen
Daddy's Roommate by Michael Willhoite
Day No Pigs Would Die by Robert Peck
Death of a Sales man by Arthur Miller
Decameron by Boccaccio
East of Eden by John Stein beck
Fallen Angel s by Walter Myers
Fanny Hill ( Memoirs of a Woman of Pleasure) by John Cleland
Flowers For Alger non by Danie Keyes
Forever by Judy Blume
Grendel by John Champlin Gardner
Halloween ABC by Eve Merriam
Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone by J.K.Rowling
Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets by J.K.Rowling
Harry Potter and the Prizoner of Azkaban by J.K.Rowling
Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire by J.K.Rowling
Have to Go by Robert Munsch
Heather Has Two Mommies by Lesle a Newman
How to Eat Fried Worms by Thomas Rockwell
Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain
I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings by Maya Angel ou
Impressions edited by Jack Booth
In the Night Kitchen by Maurice Sendak
It's Okay if You Don' t Love Me by Norma Klein
James and the Giant Peach by Roald Dahl
Lady Chatterley ' s Lover by D.H.Lawrence
Leave s of Grass by Walt Whitman
Little Red Riding Hood by Jacob and Wilhelm Grimm
Lord of the Flies by William Golding
Love is One of the Choices by Norma Klein
Lysistrata by Aristophanes
More Scary Stories in the Dark by Alvin Schwartz
My Brother Sam Is Dead by James Lincoln Collier and Christopher Collier
My House by Nikki Giovanni
My Friend Flick a by MaryO' Hara
Night Chill s by Dean Koontz
Of Mice and Men by John Stein beck
On My Honor by Marion Dane Bauer
One Day in The Life of Ivan Denisovich by Alexander Solzhenitsn
One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest by Ken Kesey
One Hundred Years of Solitude by Gabriel Garcia Marquez
Ordinary People by Judith Guest
Our Bodies, Ourselves by Boston Women 's Health Collective
Prince of Tides by Pat Conroy
Revolting Rhymes by Roald Dahl
Scary Stories 3: More Tales to Chill Your Bones by Alvin Schwartz
Scary Stories in the Dark by Alvin Schwartz
Separate Peace by John Knowles
Silas Marne r by George Eliot
Slaughterhouse- Five by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
Tarzan of the Apes by Edgar Rice Burroughs
The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn by Mark Twain
The Adventures of Tom Sawyer by Mark Twain
The Bastard by John Jakes
The Catcher in the Rye by J.D.Salinger
The Chocolate War by Robert Cormier
The Color Purple by Alice Walker
The Devil's Alter native by Frederick Forsyth
The Figure in the Shadows by John Bellairs
The Grapes of Wrath by John Stein beck
The Great Gilly Hopkins by Katherine Paterson
The Handmaid' s Tale by Margaret Atwood
The Headless Cupid by Zilpha Snyder
The Learning Tree by Gordon Parks
The Living Bible by William C.Bower
The Merchant of Venice by William Shake speare
The New Teenage Body Book by Kathy McCoy and Charles Wibbesman
The Pigman by Paul Zindel
The Seduction of Peter S. by Lawrence Sandes
The Shining by Stephen King
The Witches by Roald Dahl
The Witches of Worm by Zilph a Snyder
Then Again, Maybe I Won't by Judy Blume
To Kill A Mockingbird by Harper Lee
Twelfth Night by William Shake speare
Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionry by the Merriam-Webster
Editorial Staff
Witches, Pumpkins, and Grinning Ghosts: The Story of the Halloween
Symbols by Edna BarthTuesday September 9, 2008 - 12:26am (PDT) Permanent Link | 0 Comments - Entry for September 05, 2008
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Jewish Light Online 9/4/08
What has not been said about the Agriprocessors debate
http://www.stljewishlight.com/commentaries/308232295490801.php
BY RABBI HYIM SHAFNER
The current uproar in the Jewish community regarding Agriprocessors (Rubashkin kosher meat products) is disturbing. I do not profess inside knowledge of the company and its management. I do not know the extent to which they are guilty or innocent of the violations of which they have been widely accused, violation of labor and immigration laws and of environmental protection regulations, as well as disregard for human dignity and issues regarding animal pain.
I would like to pose several questions. What instruction does Judaism offer when the welfare of laborers is in conflict with the welfare and monetary risk of owners? With whom should we side? When we do not know all the facts, in whose favor should we err?
The following story from the Talmud (Bava Mitzia 83a) seems to address this question:
"Some hired laborers negligently broke a barrel of wine while working for Rabbah son of R. Huna. Rabbah seized their garments as collateral. The workers went and complained to Rav. Said Rav to Rabbah, 'Return their garments.' 'Is that the law?' Rabba inquired. 'Even so, return them,' Rav said, quoting a verse in Proverbs: 'That thou mayest walk in the way of good men.' Their garments having been returned, the workers observed. 'We are poor men, have worked all day, and are in need. Are we to get nothing?' 'Go and pay them,' Rav ordered Rabba. 'Is that the law?' Rabba asked. 'Nevertheless pay them,' was Rav's reply , quoting the end of the verse: 'and keep the path of the righteous.'"
It seems, in the Talmud's view, we must go beyond the letter of law, not in protecting the owners of a business but their workers, especially needy ones.
Secondly, I would ask, why is it that, for the most part, those Orthodox communities that regard the world outside of Orthodoxy as having intrinsic value have come down on the side of the plant's workers, while those communities that are more insular have defended its management? It seems that one's perspective on whether Agriprocessors has treated its employees fairly, paid its workers on time, violated the laws of the land, reflects not the individual's research or knowledge of the facts, but rather his or her Weltanschauung, world view, and understanding of the Torah's values and priorities.
Rabbi Zvi Zuravin observed this phenomenon in a recent article printed under his name in the St. Louis Jewish Light. He comments that Jewish groups critical of Agriprocessors appear to "have their own denominational and social agendas to advance, most notably the creation of a new food product certification based on their own liberal social values. Sadly, while they claim to be motivated by ethics, their behavior may suggest otherwise."
I would argue that such groups are indeed motivated by ethics, but in this case it is the Torah's ethics that motivate them. Indeed, in Judaism the commandments are divided into two major categories, those between the individual and the Divine, and those between the individual and other humans. What happens when these values are in conflict? What happens when there is not enough energy and scrupulousness to go around and give both realms their due? To which side should we lend more energy and attention, to our relationship with others or to our relationship with God? In which should we be extra careful and more conscientious, expend more religious and physical energy? In which realm should we do more than just the minimum required; in which should we go beyond the letter of the law?
What if a successful and lucrative kosher meat packing plant cannot be run without the backbreaking work of illegal laborers? What if we are told that the only way for the Jewish people to have access to affordable kosher meat is by violating the respect due to humans or animals or the environment? What if this business also supports yeshivot, Jewish institutions of higher learning? What happens when the commandments between us and God are in conflict with those between us and our fellow man? When the welfare of human beings is in conflict with making the mitzvah of keeping kosher more affordable, which would the Torah consider more important?
The obvious answer is both - but this is for idealists. Rare are the human beings who can care equally about the meat that enters their mouths and about their fellow humans and animals. One such person was Rabbi Abraham Isaac HaKohen Kook, Chief Rabbi of Palestine in the early 20th century about whom the following story is told: Rabbi Kook was walking with the younger Rabbi Aryeh Levin when Rabbi Levin absentmindedly plucked a blade of grass. Rabbi Kook was visibly shaken. "How can you kill a blade of grass for no reason?" he asked.
We are not all Rabbi Kook. It seems most of us cannot always give equal energy to both God and His humans. On which side then should we err? Which should receive more effort and care?
The commentary of Nachmanides on this past week's Torah portion (Deut. 6:18) is instructive:
"And you shall do what is good and right in the eyes of God..." Even with regard to that which you are not clearly commanded, go beyond the letter of the law. For God loves the straight, honest, and good. It is impossible for the Torah to mention all the ways in which humans will interact with their fellow humans, all their business dealings with each other, social norms and societal laws. The Torah does mention many interpersonal laws such as not being a talebearer, not taking revenge, not standing by the blood of your brother, not cursing the deaf, rising before the elderly, and so on. But then the Torah must tell us in a general way to do what is "good and right." Meaning that with regard to everything (between us and fellow humans) we must go beyond the letter of the law...we must, in every situation be plain and honest."
Thus says Nachmanides, though ritual mitzvoth must be kept to their letter, ethical mitzvoth between us and other people must be kept beyond the letter of the law. Indeed this disagreement between putting more stress on dealings with God and ritual as opposed to dealings with humans is not new. The discourse between, and the deeds of, the famous rabbis Hillel and Shamai, often reflected this divergence, with the house of Hillel placing paramount importance on the relationship between man and his fellow man. Both spoke the word of God, but the law follows the House of Hillel, for, says the Talmud, "they were nicer to people and more self-effacing."
If anyone heard even a hint of Rubashkin's meat not being kosher wouldn't all kosher observant Jews stop buying it immediately? Yet when there is the whiff of abuse of the orphan, the widow, and the stranger, too many of us do not take action. Why are so many in the observant community so careful and scrupulous about one category of commandments, those between us and God, but not about the other category of commandments, those between us and other humans?
May we merit to change our ways at this time of year, may God help us all to both serve Him and respect people fully, and may we fulfill the words of the Sefer Hachinuch on this week's Torah portion in regard to people who are immigrants from another place: "We must learn from this dear mitzvah of loving the stranger and convert to have mercy on anyone who moves to a new city where they have no family or supporters near them; just as the Torah warns us to have mercy on all people who need help.... it tells us that as we were strangers in the land of Egypt and God took us out with kindness, so too should we have mercy on any stranger in a similar position."
Rabbi Hyim Shafner serves at Bais Abraham Congregation.Friday September 5, 2008 - 01:20am (PDT) Permanent Link | 0 Comments - Entry for September 02, 2008
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from Arthur Waskow:
The Presidential Aptitude Test Center is supplying you with an educational questionnaire to run by all Presidential candidates, if you can get through police lines to do so. Test registrant fees will be refunded for anyone who is billy-clubbed more than three times.
1. In making the first "presidential" decision of your campaign, choosing a Vice-President, you felt the most important factor was:
a. Deep experience in national and international policy
b. Total lack of experience in national and international policy (the "surprise, surprise!" factor)
c. Gender
d. Modeling "family values" by good and effective parenting
e. Solidifying your political base
f. Being ready to serve as President if necessary.
g. Sucking your thumb
2. The "central front" for efforts to reduce terrorism is: -
a. The Aleutian Islands between Alaska and Russia
b.The Afghan-Pakistan frontier
c. Iraq
d. Iran
e. The checkerboard of Israeli settlements and Palestinian towns and villages
f. Despair, humiliation, joblessness, and guns among male US citizens 18 to 23 years old.
3. The most urgent response to the danger of "global scorching" is -
a. Subsidizing Big Oil with billions, to buy ads explaining it's not a problem
b. Spending billions and hiring many thousands to build efficient, swift, on-time railroads and trolley lines
c. Spending billions to destroy coal-bearing mountains in West Virgina and build factories to "clean" the coal.
d. Tripling food prices and increasing CO2 in the atmosphere by burning corn instead of petroleum.
4. The best way to deal with Afghanistan is -
a. Spending billions to follow the example of the British and Soviet empires: permanent military occupation
b. Spending billions to invade Iraq
c. Spending billions to invade Iran
d. All of the above
e. Refusing on grounds of national security to answer this question until your seventh year as President
5. The best way to affirm religious freedom in the US is to -
a. Speak in as many churches and synagogues as possible but refuse to enter a mosque.
b. Insist that grants to religious institutions to do social work be conditioned on non-discrimination in hiring, etc.
c. Offer government grants to religious institutions without any discrimination whatsoever in regard to religious belief, basing grant amounts on the degree of their support for your policies.
d. Name a specific time for the beginning of life in utero
e. Say that naming a specific time for the beginning of life in utero is far beyond your religious understanding
f. Make your own religious beliefs a major part of your campaign
g. Make your own religious beliefs a major part of your campaign only if your opponent does.
6. The best way to deal with torture as an act of US policy is to -
a. Allocate all use of torture to the CIA only, and forbid it to the Army
b. Never torture prisoners when it is possible to send them to other countries to be tortured.
c. Change the name of the School of the Americas again, forbid SOAS to teach police forces of other governments how to torture, and authorize the new institute to do so.
d. Forbid the use of torture except on non-US citizens only.
e. Forbid the use of torture except on Muslims only.
f. Give US prison guards "encore careers" as torture trainers.
g. Enough already with half-measures: repeal the Constitutional requirement for habeas corpus, plus the Fourth, Fifth, Sixth & Eighth Amendments, and abrogate the Geneva Conventions.
h. Enough already with half-measures: stop all torture.
7. The best way to prevent nuclear proliferation is to -
a. Negotiate reductions in all nuclear stocks to no more than 20 bombs for any government, including the US.
b. Use nuclear bombs to obliterate any nation that will not agree.Tuesday September 2, 2008 - 03:45pm (PDT) Permanent Link | 0 Comments
Judge it!
